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Thursday, April 30, 2020
Should the Virus Mean Straight A’s for Everyone?
The New York Times: As high schools approach the end of an academic year without proms or field trips or graduation ceremonies, another fundamental part of American education is being transformed: the report card.
Carnegie Mellon has been talking about what to do with grades since they cancelled school, or at least the students have been. CMU adopted pass/fail to be available for all classes for all students for this semester. I like this option because it gives students the choice to have a letter grade or not. I know some students are advocating towards universal pass/fail which would get rid of letter grades for all students for the semester. I, personally, do not like this solution, but I also see how this puts everyone on an even playing field and is nice. I really like the part of this article that talked about what the schools in LA are doing. They have it set up to where your grades this semester can’t hurt your average GPA meaning that your grades from this semester can’t be lower than they were before. I really like this idea because it is really hard to expect all students to be able to thrive in this situation. We have been stripped of equal opportunities, facilities, and supplies that we had on campus and using this method of grading to where it can’t hurt you but it can still help you is good for everyone, in my opinion.
The concept of grades is something has been talked about a lot since schools began to close in March. This is anything but a simple conversation or a simple decision, however, I think the answer may be clearer than it is being made out to be. In my opinion, there is no reason we should just be handed an A in any class due to the virus. First, with classes that are a full year, you have already had 3/4 of the class normally, thus there is no reason to discount these grades. For semester courses, the same goes but with 1/2 of the class. There is gets interesting is with mini 4 classes. That being said, I still think an automatic A is not the right answer. I think the solution is two facetted. First, teachers need to be understanding of what changes have happened and how they affect their students. With this understanding, teachers just need to be more flexible both in completion of assignments and in grading. The second part is what CMU is doing, which is allowing students to pass/fail. With this students have been given choices on how they want their grades to be portrayed on their report cards.
I appreciate the ways in which CMU has been very accommodating of the fact that know that students reside and work at home, there may be new challenges that come up that would not be challenging if they were working on campus. Personally, I have found it extremely difficult to find it extremely difficult to focus in class and motivate myself to do work in this online format, which was not as prominent of a challenge at school. However, I don't think that the pass/fail option was the best way to tackle this problem. There is inherently a stigma that comes with seeing a P grade, rather than a letter grade on a report. This is especially prominent for graduating students attempting to continue on to grad school. I have heard of other programs implementing an A / A- scale which effectively functions the same as pass / fail however the grade that is reported is either an A or an A-. I'm not sure this is the correct solution, however, I think it provides more of a cushion for struggling students that isn't as harsh as pass/fail. Elena Keogh
As a short answer, no. I do not think everyone should be automatically awarded an A as a result of this pandemic. However, I do agree that institutions should be making changes to the system for this quarter as a result, because there are so many unforeseen challenges to the daily life of a student that come with being online, or for many, being sent back home. I actually think that Carnegie Mellon has handled this change very well, implementing the option of pass/fail for the semester’s courses. Even if people are still trying their best, it’s really nice to know that if something went wrong, or you really started to struggle, that you have the option to take a pass. I understand that there’s stigma behind “passing” a class, because “if you had done really well why would you have taken a pass?”. However, that was the past. I feel like if you explained to an employer or educational institution that you had to pass the class because you struggled to stay afloat during a global pandemic, that they would understand the new way of the world. I do think, that Los Angeles’s approach to the situation, the hold harmless model, is a really interesting way to tackle all of this.
It is interesting to see how schools have been facing the challenge of grading with these new circumstances. Approaches seem to vary, but it is good to see more schools are becoming lenient about how they grade their students. When it comes to the question of whether or not students should receive straight A’s, it is a bit complicated. I feel that grading should be MUCH less harsh because teachers are not aware of the lives students live when they are home for this long, so their work ethic will shift. Not to mention the mental toll it takes on a person. That being said, I think the best method is what Carnegie Mellon is currently doing. Students can choose to go with a letter grade or pass or fail. Students are still working hard under these conditions and their grades should reflect that. However, it has also made it increasingly difficult, so if students still pass the class but may not get the letter grade they could've if they were doing school regularly, then pass or fail seems like the most fair option.
This is wild. I have a lot of relatives who are educators so I have heard a lot of different opinions about how to handle the current predicament in relation to grading students and approaching classwork currently. Obviously there are an immense amount of opinions on this matter because it is difficult to accept that these generations have lost out on a good quarter of education. This homeschooling and/or online schooling is simply not effective. Students did not sign up for it and were not prepared to learn in this way, and, what’s more, teachers and professors were not trained or prepared to teach in this way. I think the majority of the frustration with this current system stems from the people who believe this last minute online education is exactly as effective as the originally planned in person education. I think this automatic A system is a good way to reduce stress on students and create equity for students in a wide range of situations.
Can I just type the word “No” 150 times? Okay fine I will not, but this really is a multifaceted issue that makes me think way back to trying to understand the point of a grade point average. What purpose does it hold in the grand scheme of the information that is entering your brain? I do not really know. When it comes to college, demonstrating performance can lead you to some opportunities but at the end of the day, if you are passing your classes then you are demonstrating capability of understanding or getting through the course material well enough to have some kind of understanding. I appreciate Carnegie Mellon University's approach and I have talked to many people and I have considered the idea of how a Pass grade would be perceived on a transcript. My way of thinking is, do you really want to work for someone/participate in something that is going to lack consideration of the situation (a global pandemic!!!!) in which you make a decision to not reflect your actual grade that was given during scrambled together online school?
Grading has been a challenge forever, and COVID-19 is compounding all the inherent problems grading has and making it more apparent. The association of people with money and good grades is an unfair one that is baked into the system as the article points out. The article quoted a student that said grades are the incentive to do well. This is an interesting conversation apart from coronavirus. The idea of grading being the incentive is tough for me to wrap my head around because I most definitely rely on the pressure of trying to please my teachers to keep me in check. I’ve never found working extra hard to move the B+ up to an A- to be particularly important, but I’m sure it is for some people. The other question is how easy should we get off? For many people it's not necessarily economic stress as much as lack of motivation. Should I get off easy cause I can’t muster enough energy to bother doing my homework?
This question is a loaded one. Like, no, I do not think everyone should be handed an A just because their classes were online. I do, however, think that administrative education systems and educators themselves need to adapt their workloads and grading scales and overall flexibility to allow students to continue working in a way that is comfortable for them. Colleges have done this with their pass/fail systems. I like the system called a “hold harmless” approach. It seems like that is a good way to encourage students to keep up with their work without giving them a penalty if they cannot do that for whatever reason. There are kids stuck at home with food disparity, abusive families, no internet or computer access, or maybe they are homeless. These students should not be punished for situations they have no control over, and I hope there are accountable educators helping those kids and giving them their best chance.
I left my dorm a day before the online courses began for the university. Flying back home across the Pacific took me three whole days. After I landed, I had to move into a new house without a desk, a lamp, or a chair, while paying close attention not to have close contact with anyone. When I was finally able to start catching up with the online courses, I found one email that caught my eye immediately. The email was from one of the professors and it said that I am about to fail the course, since I have missed two classes over the past week. I am at fault as well, because I did not send a single short email to the professor reporting my circumstance. However, the email really hurt me and exceeded exhaustion. I think the most important aspect of the discussion about students’ gradings is that incredibly generous response of teachers, professors, admission offices, and educational institutions are being tested.
It is no doubt that the coronavirus pandemic has drastically re-shaped how education takes place now. While this article is specifically talking about High School students, I think a lot of the discussion is applicable to higher education as well. I recall when Carnegie Mellon first released the news about remote instruction for the remainder of the semester people lost their minds about grading and how this was going to affect graduation requirements and grade point averages. Carnegie Mellon quickly adopted the opt-in pass/fail system for students and modified the rules so that pass/fail classes will count towards degree requirements. As for the high schools across the country, I believe that High School should be preparing its students for the world beyond no matter if that is college or something else. However, for the students that will be pursuing college, I think that all high schools should follow the collegiate model and adopt opt-in pass/fail grading that still counts towards your degree.
This is a debate that has been going on really fervently in college student spaces online, and presumably teacher groups as well. With the lack of national regulation about school closures, each school has essentially been left to set its own rules. The common decision to allow Pass/Fail grading has been helpful for most students in relieving stress about grades, while still requiring and encouraging some amount of effort in the classwork in order to actually meet the course requirements for credit. There are various debates raging about if it should be ‘universal P/F’ and ‘Pass/No Credit’ and ‘A/A-’ and various other solutions instead, but I think that optional P/F for credit gives students maximum flexibility, allows people to raise their GPAs if they need to, and still maintains some necessity to actually do the bare minimum in the classwork that we’re getting credit for. This should, however, go with the expectation that students who are struggling unduly with their circumstances should be in contact with their professors, and professors should be understanding of those circumstances. It’s also important to remember that although the debate centers on colleges, it should think about high schools as well, who don’t necessarily have P/F to fall back on, and where students’ grades matter quite possibly more than many college students’ do, as they are looked at in detail on college applications where for college students it’s generally just important to have the degree, and individual grades matter less.
Although I agree that leniency should be given to all students since we have all been affected by the coronavirus in one way or another. I think what CMU is doing is great. Professors have been understanding and reasonable as well as the implementation of an optional pass/fail system is perfect because it takes the stress off but it allows people who are worried about staying on track academically to still have stellar grades on their transcripts in order to get jobs or apply to grad school. I am not sure exactly what prompted CMU to allow pass/fail as I did hear about a student petition going around so if that is the case I appreciate them honoring the students requests. The only downside of the pass/fail model is that students who don’t worry about grades are less inclined to put in the work. But at least the school year is almost over so all we can do is be hopeful about the fall.
This, as we have seen, is a really thorny problem. There's a lot of debate over what the most equitable way to grade students is at a time like this, and ultimately, I'm not sure that there is an answer. No system is going to be equitable to everyone. Switching everyone to pass fail grading fails to acknowledge the hard work and talent of standout students. Not switching to pass fail punishes students who are struggling, be it becuase of their family circumstances or becuase of the stress of this extraordinary situation. There's a part of me that thinks maybe this is the time to completely rework how students are evaluated in the American education system. Standardized tests and letter grades are already widely criticised for not evaluatign students equitably. Everything is, for lack of a better word, f**ked right now anyway, and there's not even a symblance of a working system. Something has to be decided for this semester, but in the time before and during the fall semester, maybe it's time to consider a major reworking of hwo we do things.
I agree that there needs to be flexibility in grading. Moving to a fully online environment can be hard on a person who thrives with in-person instruction and interaction. In-class discussions are not the same on Zoom. Some people do horribly in online environments. Others suffer because the nature of their learning needs that in-person aspect. What I don't agree with is everyone getting an automatic A. First, you award lack of trying which sets the student up to expect an A for any effort put in even if it is sub-par. Second, you encourage students to "give up" for the rest of the semester. They don't do their homework, the don't care about tests and this also means that there is no way to assess their learning and comprehension of the material. Students who just sit back and collect the easy A are also putting themselves at a disadvantage for future success. What you learn now in high school in terms of work ethic can carry you through a successful career or not, depending on how you develop your habits. Easy A's allow for some bad habits to develop. I do think that instructors need to be flexible and that there should be a Pass/No Pass Option for this semester only. I think schools that do summer classes, even if they are online, should return to normal grading standards after this semester is over. A little leeway because of the switch mid-semester, but now that you've had time to adapt, it's time to return to the previous standards.
15 comments:
Carnegie Mellon has been talking about what to do with grades since they cancelled school, or at least the students have been. CMU adopted pass/fail to be available for all classes for all students for this semester. I like this option because it gives students the choice to have a letter grade or not. I know some students are advocating towards universal pass/fail which would get rid of letter grades for all students for the semester. I, personally, do not like this solution, but I also see how this puts everyone on an even playing field and is nice. I really like the part of this article that talked about what the schools in LA are doing. They have it set up to where your grades this semester can’t hurt your average GPA meaning that your grades from this semester can’t be lower than they were before. I really like this idea because it is really hard to expect all students to be able to thrive in this situation. We have been stripped of equal opportunities, facilities, and supplies that we had on campus and using this method of grading to where it can’t hurt you but it can still help you is good for everyone, in my opinion.
The concept of grades is something has been talked about a lot since schools began to close in March. This is anything but a simple conversation or a simple decision, however, I think the answer may be clearer than it is being made out to be. In my opinion, there is no reason we should just be handed an A in any class due to the virus. First, with classes that are a full year, you have already had 3/4 of the class normally, thus there is no reason to discount these grades. For semester courses, the same goes but with 1/2 of the class. There is gets interesting is with mini 4 classes. That being said, I still think an automatic A is not the right answer. I think the solution is two facetted. First, teachers need to be understanding of what changes have happened and how they affect their students. With this understanding, teachers just need to be more flexible both in completion of assignments and in grading. The second part is what CMU is doing, which is allowing students to pass/fail. With this students have been given choices on how they want their grades to be portrayed on their report cards.
I appreciate the ways in which CMU has been very accommodating of the fact that know that students reside and work at home, there may be new challenges that come up that would not be challenging if they were working on campus. Personally, I have found it extremely difficult to find it extremely difficult to focus in class and motivate myself to do work in this online format, which was not as prominent of a challenge at school. However, I don't think that the pass/fail option was the best way to tackle this problem. There is inherently a stigma that comes with seeing a P grade, rather than a letter grade on a report. This is especially prominent for graduating students attempting to continue on to grad school. I have heard of other programs implementing an A / A- scale which effectively functions the same as pass / fail however the grade that is reported is either an A or an A-. I'm not sure this is the correct solution, however, I think it provides more of a cushion for struggling students that isn't as harsh as pass/fail. Elena Keogh
As a short answer, no. I do not think everyone should be automatically awarded an A as a result of this pandemic. However, I do agree that institutions should be making changes to the system for this quarter as a result, because there are so many unforeseen challenges to the daily life of a student that come with being online, or for many, being sent back home. I actually think that Carnegie Mellon has handled this change very well, implementing the option of pass/fail for the semester’s courses. Even if people are still trying their best, it’s really nice to know that if something went wrong, or you really started to struggle, that you have the option to take a pass. I understand that there’s stigma behind “passing” a class, because “if you had done really well why would you have taken a pass?”. However, that was the past. I feel like if you explained to an employer or educational institution that you had to pass the class because you struggled to stay afloat during a global pandemic, that they would understand the new way of the world. I do think, that Los Angeles’s approach to the situation, the hold harmless model, is a really interesting way to tackle all of this.
It is interesting to see how schools have been facing the challenge of grading with these new circumstances. Approaches seem to vary, but it is good to see more schools are becoming lenient about how they grade their students. When it comes to the question of whether or not students should receive straight A’s, it is a bit complicated. I feel that grading should be MUCH less harsh because teachers are not aware of the lives students live when they are home for this long, so their work ethic will shift. Not to mention the mental toll it takes on a person. That being said, I think the best method is what Carnegie Mellon is currently doing. Students can choose to go with a letter grade or pass or fail. Students are still working hard under these conditions and their grades should reflect that. However, it has also made it increasingly difficult, so if students still pass the class but may not get the letter grade they could've if they were doing school regularly, then pass or fail seems like the most fair option.
This is wild. I have a lot of relatives who are educators so I have heard a lot of different opinions about how to handle the current predicament in relation to grading students and approaching classwork currently. Obviously there are an immense amount of opinions on this matter because it is difficult to accept that these generations have lost out on a good quarter of education. This homeschooling and/or online schooling is simply not effective. Students did not sign up for it and were not prepared to learn in this way, and, what’s more, teachers and professors were not trained or prepared to teach in this way. I think the majority of the frustration with this current system stems from the people who believe this last minute online education is exactly as effective as the originally planned in person education. I think this automatic A system is a good way to reduce stress on students and create equity for students in a wide range of situations.
Can I just type the word “No” 150 times? Okay fine I will not, but this really is a multifaceted issue that makes me think way back to trying to understand the point of a grade point average. What purpose does it hold in the grand scheme of the information that is entering your brain? I do not really know. When it comes to college, demonstrating performance can lead you to some opportunities but at the end of the day, if you are passing your classes then you are demonstrating capability of understanding or getting through the course material well enough to have some kind of understanding. I appreciate Carnegie Mellon University's approach and I have talked to many people and I have considered the idea of how a Pass grade would be perceived on a transcript. My way of thinking is, do you really want to work for someone/participate in something that is going to lack consideration of the situation (a global pandemic!!!!) in which you make a decision to not reflect your actual grade that was given during scrambled together online school?
Grading has been a challenge forever, and COVID-19 is compounding all the inherent problems grading has and making it more apparent. The association of people with money and good grades is an unfair one that is baked into the system as the article points out.
The article quoted a student that said grades are the incentive to do well. This is an interesting conversation apart from coronavirus. The idea of grading being the incentive is tough for me to wrap my head around because I most definitely rely on the pressure of trying to please my teachers to keep me in check. I’ve never found working extra hard to move the B+ up to an A- to be particularly important, but I’m sure it is for some people. The other question is how easy should we get off? For many people it's not necessarily economic stress as much as lack of motivation. Should I get off easy cause I can’t muster enough energy to bother doing my homework?
This question is a loaded one. Like, no, I do not think everyone should be handed an A just because their classes were online. I do, however, think that administrative education systems and educators themselves need to adapt their workloads and grading scales and overall flexibility to allow students to continue working in a way that is comfortable for them. Colleges have done this with their pass/fail systems. I like the system called a “hold harmless” approach. It seems like that is a good way to encourage students to keep up with their work without giving them a penalty if they cannot do that for whatever reason. There are kids stuck at home with food disparity, abusive families, no internet or computer access, or maybe they are homeless. These students should not be punished for situations they have no control over, and I hope there are accountable educators helping those kids and giving them their best chance.
I left my dorm a day before the online courses began for the university. Flying back home across the Pacific took me three whole days. After I landed, I had to move into a new house without a desk, a lamp, or a chair, while paying close attention not to have close contact with anyone. When I was finally able to start catching up with the online courses, I found one email that caught my eye immediately. The email was from one of the professors and it said that I am about to fail the course, since I have missed two classes over the past week. I am at fault as well, because I did not send a single short email to the professor reporting my circumstance. However, the email really hurt me and exceeded exhaustion. I think the most important aspect of the discussion about students’ gradings is that incredibly generous response of teachers, professors, admission offices, and educational institutions are being tested.
It is no doubt that the coronavirus pandemic has drastically re-shaped how education takes place now. While this article is specifically talking about High School students, I think a lot of the discussion is applicable to higher education as well. I recall when Carnegie Mellon first released the news about remote instruction for the remainder of the semester people lost their minds about grading and how this was going to affect graduation requirements and grade point averages. Carnegie Mellon quickly adopted the opt-in pass/fail system for students and modified the rules so that pass/fail classes will count towards degree requirements. As for the high schools across the country, I believe that High School should be preparing its students for the world beyond no matter if that is college or something else. However, for the students that will be pursuing college, I think that all high schools should follow the collegiate model and adopt opt-in pass/fail grading that still counts towards your degree.
This is a debate that has been going on really fervently in college student spaces online, and presumably teacher groups as well. With the lack of national regulation about school closures, each school has essentially been left to set its own rules. The common decision to allow Pass/Fail grading has been helpful for most students in relieving stress about grades, while still requiring and encouraging some amount of effort in the classwork in order to actually meet the course requirements for credit. There are various debates raging about if it should be ‘universal P/F’ and ‘Pass/No Credit’ and ‘A/A-’ and various other solutions instead, but I think that optional P/F for credit gives students maximum flexibility, allows people to raise their GPAs if they need to, and still maintains some necessity to actually do the bare minimum in the classwork that we’re getting credit for. This should, however, go with the expectation that students who are struggling unduly with their circumstances should be in contact with their professors, and professors should be understanding of those circumstances. It’s also important to remember that although the debate centers on colleges, it should think about high schools as well, who don’t necessarily have P/F to fall back on, and where students’ grades matter quite possibly more than many college students’ do, as they are looked at in detail on college applications where for college students it’s generally just important to have the degree, and individual grades matter less.
Although I agree that leniency should be given to all students since we have all been affected by the coronavirus in one way or another. I think what CMU is doing is great. Professors have been understanding and reasonable as well as the implementation of an optional pass/fail system is perfect because it takes the stress off but it allows people who are worried about staying on track academically to still have stellar grades on their transcripts in order to get jobs or apply to grad school. I am not sure exactly what prompted CMU to allow pass/fail as I did hear about a student petition going around so if that is the case I appreciate them honoring the students requests. The only downside of the pass/fail model is that students who don’t worry about grades are less inclined to put in the work. But at least the school year is almost over so all we can do is be hopeful about the fall.
This, as we have seen, is a really thorny problem. There's a lot of debate over what the most equitable way to grade students is at a time like this, and ultimately, I'm not sure that there is an answer. No system is going to be equitable to everyone. Switching everyone to pass fail grading fails to acknowledge the hard work and talent of standout students. Not switching to pass fail punishes students who are struggling, be it becuase of their family circumstances or becuase of the stress of this extraordinary situation. There's a part of me that thinks maybe this is the time to completely rework how students are evaluated in the American education system. Standardized tests and letter grades are already widely criticised for not evaluatign students equitably. Everything is, for lack of a better word, f**ked right now anyway, and there's not even a symblance of a working system. Something has to be decided for this semester, but in the time before and during the fall semester, maybe it's time to consider a major reworking of hwo we do things.
I agree that there needs to be flexibility in grading. Moving to a fully online environment can be hard on a person who thrives with in-person instruction and interaction. In-class discussions are not the same on Zoom. Some people do horribly in online environments. Others suffer because the nature of their learning needs that in-person aspect. What I don't agree with is everyone getting an automatic A. First, you award lack of trying which sets the student up to expect an A for any effort put in even if it is sub-par. Second, you encourage students to "give up" for the rest of the semester. They don't do their homework, the don't care about tests and this also means that there is no way to assess their learning and comprehension of the material. Students who just sit back and collect the easy A are also putting themselves at a disadvantage for future success. What you learn now in high school in terms of work ethic can carry you through a successful career or not, depending on how you develop your habits. Easy A's allow for some bad habits to develop. I do think that instructors need to be flexible and that there should be a Pass/No Pass Option for this semester only. I think schools that do summer classes, even if they are online, should return to normal grading standards after this semester is over. A little leeway because of the switch mid-semester, but now that you've had time to adapt, it's time to return to the previous standards.
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