Pittsburgh Arts, Regional Theatre, New Work, Producing, Copyright, Labor Unions,
New Products, Coping Skills, J-O-Bs...
Theatre industry news, University & School of Drama Announcements, plus occasional course support for
Carnegie Mellon School of Drama Faculty, Staff, Students, and Alumni.
www.popularwoodworking.com: Over the holidays, I saw the same question asked on both an American and British woodworking forum. The poster had received a new table saw for Christmas, had no experience and wanted to learn how to use the saw safely.
"Sometimes the British get things right." Well that's an interesting comment. Seems to me they're right about a lot more things than we give them credit for, and this is just one example from all the aspects of life that they have managed to make more simple and practical than Americans ever manage. I would love to try the British version of the table saw to see how it feels different and better understand the safety precautions they take for granted and we have never been able to incorporate into our own shops. A table saw with no kickback? Sounds good to me. But then, something that awesome is bound to have some drawbacks. I'd be interested to see the American response to this user's question.
We were just talking today in advanced fabrication about how some of the older shops in the UK have never heard of a fence and just draw out the straight line that they need to cut. we also have our shop rule of the blade not being more then half a finger thickness past the material. Some oldschool shops run their blades at full hight off of the table because it causes the teeth of the blade to cut in a downward direction as opposed to the more horizontal force that is put on the blade when the blade is lower.
I do like the statement they make though that they just went ahead and made a blade guard that doesnt get in the way (as much as possible) when your working. Things seem to be easier for the british seeing as their solution is just make it work.
I didn't realize that British tools differed that much from American tools. I would think that if the British tool was safer than the American tool, more people would be eager to use it. I wonder how long Delta offered the British style of the tool before pulling it because it wasn't selling as well as other tools. Perhaps if the company had marketed it towards schools and universities, they may have had better results. It would seem to make sense that most people working professionally wouldn't want to have to learn how to use a new type of tool if the style they're used to still works perfectly fine. On the same track of thought, it would also make sense that schools would be more willing to invest in a new style of tool that is safer since many of the people who will be using the tool are inexperienced and unskilled.
Wait, you mean to tell me that SawStop isn't the answer to all of table saw safety problems!? There are alternative solutions to creating safer usage of a table saw other than jamming a block of aluminum into the blade with a pneumatic cylinder? And cutting your finger or hand off isn't the accident a user is most prone to if using the tool correctly?
MIND=BLOWN
To be serious for a second, this is a very interesting comparison of the approach, understanding and knowledge of this tool by the two western superpowers, specifically in the way that they care or don't care rather about educating their citizens. If you review the literature provided by the column's author it is very clear that the British version of the table saw is generally more user friendly and designed to actually educate an individual, as opposed to the American version that basically says, 'These are the bad things that can happen to you, and oh yeah, here are some pretty pictures of saws.'
When comparing the two saws I think that the difference in fence design is the biggest takeaway. The British design being shorter and not entering the throat of the blade is the key element in limiting a kick-back factor. For American saws with a fence that is the entire depth of the table, limiting this factor is left to the operator and the assumption that the fence is calibrated properly...however the blade guards really aren't much different. A perfect example is the latest design from Delta- the blade guard is incredibly similar to that of the Brits' Axminster.
It's unfortunate that the old Delta Atlantic design didn't take hold; I'm sure this was a few years ago when people weren't so hard up for safety and most contractors/carpenters didn't even use a fence. This is a huge assumption as I can't find an actual span of production for that model. Even now it would be difficult for a design like that to take hold in the US just because it's different and we simply don't like change here. "What we have works, why change it...the Brits are crazy, that's why we had a revolution after all!" - yeah, no. Unfortunately, the educational market isn't deep enough to push a change like this, 'we' make up an exponentially small piece of that pie.
So...we'll just continue to be American about it and hopefully someone will at least come up with something better than SawStop.
I found this to be very enlightening in term of learning something new about our old friend the table saw/circular saw benches. (table saw so much easier, come on Brits) This article has some very good points and very interesting ideas to look at for continuing using the saw. I would be intrigue to try out the half fence as well as the other suggestions the Brits have come up with. Also really like the concept of making something that works, when what is previously there does not. (Isn't that how America came about?) Yet again the Brits are showing us how to do things. I bet most Americans are thinking oo we just have a new robotic thumb installed or I will wear a steel plate over my groin to protect from kick back. To bad robotic thumbs have not be invented yet (atleast to my knowledge) and steel plate groin protect is inconvenient to say the least.
Other than the standard American way of thinking, "If it aint broke don't fix it", I see no reason to not adopt the British table saw format. It seems like its safer and eliminates problems we could do without. It sounds like a change over of some sort was attempted by Delta but it didn't catch on for some reason or another. But if people are not using American machinery blade guards, which are there for their safety, something should probably be changed.
Yeah, sure they get some things right, just don't ask them to plan an invasion of occupied France. Dunkirk aside, both British and American commentators posting below this article hit on the truth about the table saw: there is no substitute for common sense and no safe-guard against carelessness. The table saw is a dangerous tool, yes, but so is a sharp chisel. The closest I've ever come to losing a finger was using the latter. Why? Inattentiveness and lack of experience. The immitigable fact is the cost of acquiring experience with the table saw, or any tool, can be high. Government doucuments and regulations are what they are, and hearing different approaches to and set ups for a tool use is helpful and instructive, as long as we remember that the buck, or maybe in this case it would be more appropriate to say the kickback, stops with you.
I love this. Its a great example of the ridiculous regulation getting in the way of common sense. I very much agree with Joseph in his realization that WHAT??? SAW STOPS AREN'T ALWAYS THE ANSWER? That being said, I think this article lacked in specifics, so I don't want to judge too much.
This article is so much more than just table saws. Overall, American mentality is so much more over-bearing and cautious than the rest of the world. The constant fear of lawsuits have made this country double-guess itself at every chance and over engineer solutions so as to avoid and misuse. This sense of exaggerated protection could be harmful for our progress and may even lead to the USA being left behind in innovation compared to other countries with looser regulations and a broader sense of thinking.
9 comments:
"Sometimes the British get things right." Well that's an interesting comment. Seems to me they're right about a lot more things than we give them credit for, and this is just one example from all the aspects of life that they have managed to make more simple and practical than Americans ever manage. I would love to try the British version of the table saw to see how it feels different and better understand the safety precautions they take for granted and we have never been able to incorporate into our own shops. A table saw with no kickback? Sounds good to me. But then, something that awesome is bound to have some drawbacks. I'd be interested to see the American response to this user's question.
We were just talking today in advanced fabrication about how some of the older shops in the UK have never heard of a fence and just draw out the straight line that they need to cut. we also have our shop rule of the blade not being more then half a finger thickness past the material. Some oldschool shops run their blades at full hight off of the table because it causes the teeth of the blade to cut in a downward direction as opposed to the more horizontal force that is put on the blade when the blade is lower.
I do like the statement they make though that they just went ahead and made a blade guard that doesnt get in the way (as much as possible) when your working. Things seem to be easier for the british seeing as their solution is just make it work.
I didn't realize that British tools differed that much from American tools. I would think that if the British tool was safer than the American tool, more people would be eager to use it. I wonder how long Delta offered the British style of the tool before pulling it because it wasn't selling as well as other tools. Perhaps if the company had marketed it towards schools and universities, they may have had better results. It would seem to make sense that most people working professionally wouldn't want to have to learn how to use a new type of tool if the style they're used to still works perfectly fine. On the same track of thought, it would also make sense that schools would be more willing to invest in a new style of tool that is safer since many of the people who will be using the tool are inexperienced and unskilled.
Wait, you mean to tell me that SawStop isn't the answer to all of table saw safety problems!? There are alternative solutions to creating safer usage of a table saw other than jamming a block of aluminum into the blade with a pneumatic cylinder? And cutting your finger or hand off isn't the accident a user is most prone to if using the tool correctly?
MIND=BLOWN
To be serious for a second, this is a very interesting comparison of the approach, understanding and knowledge of this tool by the two western superpowers, specifically in the way that they care or don't care rather about educating their citizens. If you review the literature provided by the column's author it is very clear that the British version of the table saw is generally more user friendly and designed to actually educate an individual, as opposed to the American version that basically says, 'These are the bad things that can happen to you, and oh yeah, here are some pretty pictures of saws.'
When comparing the two saws I think that the difference in fence design is the biggest takeaway. The British design being shorter and not entering the throat of the blade is the key element in limiting a kick-back factor. For American saws with a fence that is the entire depth of the table, limiting this factor is left to the operator and the assumption that the fence is calibrated properly...however the blade guards really aren't much different. A perfect example is the latest design from Delta- the blade guard is incredibly similar to that of the Brits' Axminster.
It's unfortunate that the old Delta Atlantic design didn't take hold; I'm sure this was a few years ago when people weren't so hard up for safety and most contractors/carpenters didn't even use a fence. This is a huge assumption as I can't find an actual span of production for that model. Even now it would be difficult for a design like that to take hold in the US just because it's different and we simply don't like change here. "What we have works, why change it...the Brits are crazy, that's why we had a revolution after all!" - yeah, no.
Unfortunately, the educational market isn't deep enough to push a change like this, 'we' make up an exponentially small piece of that pie.
So...we'll just continue to be American about it and hopefully someone will at least come up with something better than SawStop.
I found this to be very enlightening in term of learning something new about our old friend the table saw/circular saw benches. (table saw so much easier, come on Brits) This article has some very good points and very interesting ideas to look at for continuing using the saw. I would be intrigue to try out the half fence as well as the other suggestions the Brits have come up with. Also really like the concept of making something that works, when what is previously there does not. (Isn't that how America came about?) Yet again the Brits are showing us how to do things. I bet most Americans are thinking oo we just have a new robotic thumb installed or I will wear a steel plate over my groin to protect from kick back. To bad robotic thumbs have not be invented yet (atleast to my knowledge) and steel plate groin protect is inconvenient to say the least.
Other than the standard American way of thinking, "If it aint broke don't fix it", I see no reason to not adopt the British table saw format. It seems like its safer and eliminates problems we could do without. It sounds like a change over of some sort was attempted by Delta but it didn't catch on for some reason or another. But if people are not using American machinery blade guards, which are there for their safety, something should probably be changed.
Yeah, sure they get some things right, just don't ask them to plan an invasion of occupied France. Dunkirk aside, both British and American commentators posting below this article hit on the truth about the table saw: there is no substitute for common sense and no safe-guard against carelessness. The table saw is a dangerous tool, yes, but so is a sharp chisel. The closest I've ever come to losing a finger was using the latter. Why? Inattentiveness and lack of experience. The immitigable fact is the cost of acquiring experience with the table saw, or any tool, can be high. Government doucuments and regulations are what they are, and hearing different approaches to and set ups for a tool use is helpful and instructive, as long as we remember that the buck, or maybe in this case it would be more appropriate to say the kickback, stops with you.
I love this. Its a great example of the ridiculous regulation getting in the way of common sense. I very much agree with Joseph in his realization that WHAT??? SAW STOPS AREN'T ALWAYS THE ANSWER? That being said, I think this article lacked in specifics, so I don't want to judge too much.
This article is so much more than just table saws. Overall, American mentality is so much more over-bearing and cautious than the rest of the world. The constant fear of lawsuits have made this country double-guess itself at every chance and over engineer solutions so as to avoid and misuse. This sense of exaggerated protection could be harmful for our progress and may even lead to the USA being left behind in innovation compared to other countries with looser regulations and a broader sense of thinking.
Post a Comment