Thursday, November 19, 2015
Why Most Internships Are Actually Illegal
Viral Viral Videos: Being an an unpaid intern while still in college might be exciting at first, but the novelty of making copies and getting people who don’t respect you coffee everyday wears off really quick. Actually, most people don’t realize that many internships aren’t just scams, but are actually illegal under the terms set by the department of labor.
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I'm really glad that there is some kind of media talking about this issue, because overall it seems like such a ridiculous thing to not have already been taken care of with stricter legislation. There is another aspect that has not been touched on, however. Many companies, I've noticed, have taken to the tactic of only hiring interns that can prove that their college will "give them credit" for the internship. Companies do this in order to excuse any kind of regulation regarding paying the intern. This is incredibly problematic, because no student from a more well-known or perhaps higher-quality university is going to be able to "receive credit" for working at an organization over the summer. Many universities, such as Carnegie Mellon, have strict curriculums that are highly unlikely to be altered or excused of in any way, so this mostly just ends up detracting equally or more qualified candidates AND still exploits interns by having them work for free.
Honestly even though it's just a College Humor YouTube video, this hits home for me. Coming out of freshman year of college we are told we can expect to have to choose between finding a paying job for the summer, or getting an internship where we gain valuable experience in the field we want to work. And most of us already know that in many places "valuable experience" means "coffee bitch". I think that this is a little different for us, interning in shops or at theaters, than for our friends working in financial offices but it's still something we have to consider. Do we take the chance that we might actually gain real valuable experience? And the decision is even harder for those students who are not completely financially supported by someone else. As this video points out, I think the unpaid internship system as a whole is more problematic than people care to admit or are even aware of.
We learned about this in technical management. Molly told us that most of the internships we will be offered will likely be scams and that we should turn them down. Especially as an artist it is very easy for somebody to want you to work for free. That being said, unless many more people know about how illegal these unpaid internships are, they will continue to exist and flourish. Once people realize how bad this is, or until stricter legislation is put in place, it will be almost impossible to get rid of these completely. One thing that Molly did tell us is that we should never take an unpaid internship that we think might be illegal unless it is working under somebody famous, or at a famous theater. Although I completely understand where she is coming from, that it would really boost the resume to have that name on it, but I really don't think it is helping the cause to give into these illegal endeavors just because the person is famous. Honestly, this is worse than a regular unpaid internships. It's saying that the only way to get this name on your resume is to be rich enough to have somebody support you while you work for free. It's being very prohibitive to the people who need jobs just as much but can not afford it.
I think the absolute best (read worst) example of this was when a company auctioned off an internship for $20,000. Nothing says you are qualified like having rich parents right? But I'm going to disagree with Paula. Maybe Molly is saying that now, but when I took the class she was pointing out it is illegal not telling us not to do it. If the only work you can find is an unpaid summer-stock internship than that's what you gotta do. The statistic in the video about how internships do not help you get jobs is an average of all the industries. In the entertainment industry having something on your resume is a must. So if you can find something paid, absolutely that is preferable, but if you had a rough year, or just a lot of bad luck, you still got to do something with your time.
Although I also hope this starts to get more attention. It is acceptable now, but hopefully we are approaching an age where this will not only be illegal, but the law will actually be enforced.
The elitism that's at the core of the stereotypical internship is something that this video does a great job of acknowledging. The idea that someone couldn't afford to work at a company seems a little ridiculous at first, but unfortunately that's now the reality in many workplaces. Internships are important resume builders, but examining the cost is something that's crucial. For example, I live in central NJ and if I were to do an internship in New York I would spending $30 a day on train tickets a day. Obviously a monthly pass might lower this cost a bit, but it would still add up to a significant amount of money. I'm lucky enough to come from a background in which my parents would support me through this, but I know that I'm not the majority. So many people who could bring great things to companies will never have to opportunity to shine unless we shift towards a paid internship system, or even better increase the availability of entry level jobs.
I thought that this video was simultaneously funny and eye- opening; I had no idea that the Department of Labor had laws set about what qualities as an “internship” and what is illegal. I think that this video is particularly applicable to our freshman DP class, where everyone is planning on what internship/ summer theater experience they will be pursuing. People seem to have strong opinions about whether or not unpaid internships are worth it, especially in the theater world. Personally, I feel like I would get much more valuable experience applicable to what I want to do if I were to be part of a paint crew for a smaller theater company than if I were to get coffee for a scenic designer at a bigger, more well-known company. However, I do understand how it makes sense to try and do anything you can with a larger company in order to “get your name known” and “make connections”. I’m still not sure if I will be pursuing an internship this summer, and if it makes sense or not to settle for something unpaid (CMU tuition makes me think not), but it’s definitely a delicate line to balance between trying to work your way up and being taken advantage of.
I think that what makes this a tricky situation is that valuable internships exist, it is just very hard to tell those apart from ones that are a waste of time. You need to really know what you are going to be doing there, and I assume trying to get the perspectives of previous interns will be helpful. I have friends who have had internships they’ve really liked, mostly in the tech industry. I’m wondering if different industries have different standards for how much interns do and what interns typically do. For example, I’d imagine interning at a law firm would be very different than interning for a software company. What I need to figure out is what makes sense in terms of internships in the entertainment industry, and I honestly don’t know how similar those internships are to the type of internships portrayed in this video. Watching this video hasn’t made me decide not to try to get an internship, but I think I am going to be cautious about what I apply for.
Luckily, I think unpaid internships are starting to get less and less common in our industry. Companies are starting to realize they can get into real trouble for not paying their interns, even if they are just paying a small stipend. If a company is trying to get unpaid interns, it is a sign that they are not a very good company to be working for. With that said, I think everyone needs to evaluate the pros and cons of every internship before taking it. I've only done 1 unpaid internship, and I ended up gaining a lot of valuable experience from it. In the end, I'm happy I took that internship. It was right for me at the time. If someone if being offered an unpaid internship, they should ask a lot of questions about what their educational opportunities will be before taking the job. If the employer can not give concrete examples of the work the intern will be doing, the experience will likely be a letdown. What stood out to me in this video is the fact that not everyone has the luxury of taking an unpaid internship. People that live in the city of their internship of choice are lucky. People that have parents that can support them through an unpaid internship are lucky. If we are allowing unpaid internships to exist, we are alienating those who do not come from families with enough money to support them work for free. This, to me, is the biggest problem we have to address with unpaid internships.
I’ve often heard about the various schemes that are out there for some free labor. You mainly hear about it with larger corporations who take advantage of making the interns do the laborious work of fetching coffee, doing simple paperwork, and answering phones. I’m not sure if it works the same in a different type of environment with a particular set of trade skills. At least if the trade you are working in allows you to hone those skill sets, then all is not lost on an unpaid internship. You have the ability to learn, and then further use those skills towards advancing to a job. Rather than having to work long work weeks doing monotonous work that does absolutely nothing to benefit you in the long run other than maybe making a connection or two that you might be able to use down the road if need be. You wouldn’t want to quit your internship because then it doesn’t show commitment, but then you also don’t want to stay because there is no experience in doing what you do.
Unpaid internships is just one of those topics that constantly frustrates me. Don't work for free, it's that simple. If you too are frustrated by companies taking advantage of unpaid interns, then the most powerful statement you can make is with by voting with your feet: don't accept an unpaid position. I would like to think that everybody believes their time is worth something, so you shouldn't give it away for free. Even in the case of an unpaid internship being paid in the form of "good exposure", I still can't see a scenario where an employer can honestly rationalize not paying people that are performing work for them. I would also like to think that CMU students are interning at institutions whose profit margins are not so razor thin that they cannot even afford to pay minimum wage to their workers. And yes, I know Theatre as an industry is especially bad in the area of unpaid internships, but to be completely honest, any School of Drama student, of any year, has the ability to proficiently perform tasks of value to a theatre employer.
In general, I think unpaid internships are just awful, which seems to be the common outlook by young adults and college students. I’m glad that this video takes a moment to address one of the very critical problems with unpaid internships- that those individuals coming from low-income families are essentially not eligible for them unless they work a second job to support themselves while taking on an internship. So much for upward mobility and trying to achieve some version of your American dream when you can’t even afford to take on an unpaid internship to try and better yourself.
The biggest dilemma, as I see it, is that the institutional perspective that is in charge of “hiring” interns seems to be of the mindset that they did it once so you can do it too. In my experience, this mantra is not isolated to just one person, it trickles down through organizations that have always had unpaid internships. At these types of places it is very difficult to find funds to pay an intern, especially when interns have never been paid. I worked at a theatre once that caved to the unpaid intern pressure by just eliminating the internship all together. How’s that for progress?
This -- this is it. Last year Molly had a lecture in Basic PTM about internships and their value, and everything she said was reflected in the video I just watched. Interns are basically secretaries without pay, if they're not learning anything. And us young people can be so easily manipulated into doing these jobs because we think we're doing it for the "experience", when all it does is overwork, over-stress, and underpay us until we're burned out and don't want anything to do with the job we interned for in the first place. Looking back on my internship over the summer, it's difficult to say whether it was completely educational or more secretarial. Sure, I learned some things and sat in some techs, but for a lot of it I went around New York basically as a shopper for an associate costume designer. It might have been fun going to Bloomingdales with a heck of a lot of petty cash and buying what I thought was the right fit for the costume, but was I actually learning? Debatable. Next time I'm going to make damn sure that I am always learning, and that the internship is benefitting me rather than benefitting the product I'm turning out.
I'm really glad Molly had this conversation with us in PTM before many of us accepted, or in some cases even applied to internships. Although I'm glad to say the internship I had this past summer was a real internship, where although I was only paid a small stipend, I wasn't overworked and it was more of an educational experience than anything else, its still annoying to hear that so many other college students like me are being taken advantage of for free labor. Not only is it morally wrong, its also in many ways degrading to ask an intelligent and qualified individual to do minor tasks like fetch coffee when they could just as easily be a valued leader at a different organization. As I'm starting to prepare for applying to internships/jobs for next summer, I hope my friends and I are all aware enough to avoid falling into this trap. I'm glad collegehumor is making an effort to spread the word and make sure everyone understands the significance and expansive presence of this real issue.
For many students, especially in the arts world, the lure of exciting prospects and the fear of never getting a job makes the unpaid internship seem like a great idea at first glance. It's a way to get your name out there, or to have something juicy to put on the resume. The issue comes when a student realizes that they are being treated unfairly, but are too worried about their potential job prospects to complain. Students are told that they are lucky to have the internship at all, that many people would be happy to replace them, and the students fear that if they complain, they will be labelled as difficult and won't get hired. There needs to be more effective regulation of internships to provide support for mistreated workers, create equal opportunities for people of all socioeconomic levels to apply for positions, and stop using interns as a source to free grunt work, and instead think of it as grooming a future generation for success.
I am one of those people who are always aware about internships. I certainly can do no-pay internship as long as I can learn things, and that’s how I actually came into theatre world and learn about music technology and sound design and learned the word stage management, is from internship which I supposed to just accompany and assisting voice coaching as a music student. I will definitely never know about this industry if I just make coffee and photo copying all the time. Which is something I really aware of I would never apply to a place that does that to intern, and I know there’s so many places like that in the world. I am so grateful that every place I interned at I learned so, so many things and actually put my time and energy into it, same as when I am here. It sounds like hell to work in a place that runs with CMU clock, but it’s very useful and everyone is willing to teach you as long as you are willing to learn.
My first exposure to theater was a "volunteer" gig that kept me occupied until 11:00 on school nights, back when I was a freshman in high school, with a workload and sleep schedule that did not mesh with this scheduling. I eventually received compensation for my time there ( as my duties were above and beyond the duties of other volunteers, who organized programs and baked cookies for the concessions table.) Watching this video brought old memories of those days to the surface, as I realized how many labor laws my former employers were breaking. Not only was my time with them exceeding the hours allotted on my work permit, I was gaining little new knowledge after the first week or so, and fundamentally misunderstanding how different the rest of the world operates. While stagecraft crew and run crew here are both extensions of classroom learning, my own experiences with the industry at that point would have me blindly accept the work out of a misguided sense that the work would be somehow beneficial to me. In summary, do your research, especially when it comes to jobs.
Great points in this video include the fact that young people from lower income families are immediately put at a disadvantage when it comes to having the luxury to work for free. This is a huge issue that, if altered in the workplace (especially in financial corporations) could mean a major shift in the economic mobility of our country. Now, that aside, it is a different situation when it comes to the world of theatre. On the one hand, if you are working as an intern at a not for profit theatre, no matter its size, you know that the skills you are receiving are administrative, from a staff member point of view, and you definitely build a relationship with those staff members. If you are interning in some sort of an artistic way, it puts you into the room with established (or semi-established) artists that you can genuinely learn from. The major issue here is that people fall for false advertising, which is ultimately their fault for not doing the research into what the position actually is (find the number of the current intern, or call the company and ask the actual questions. IF they are afraid to answer, or the answer isn't what you want, then don't work there.
A proposition, now, for a potentially better policy. Some young companies thrive on interns, and the fact of the matter is that the smaller the company, the more the interns actually learn about running a company. Therefore, it may be the right move to think about a certain budgetary limit for a theatre company, depending on the city, such that, after a certain point of growth, the company is required to pay their interns.
I've commented on the issue before, but I think that unpaid internships are a very tricky business. The line that is difficult to toe, I think, is whether the internship is serving as a valuable form of education or not. In some cases, the employer might believe that he or she is doing a good job of providing an educational experience for the intern, when in reality, the intern is frustrated, bored, or feeling used. This is an especially difficult situation because, like Olivia said, the intern is taught to be thankful for the opportunity they've been given, and not speak up when they are feeling undervalued. The employer/intern relationship is not one we have a set standard for yet, or at least I don't, so it is difficult to know what things can be said and what things can't. It's really just a very wishy washy kind of employment that, if possible, I would like to avoid. I think my mom, who supported me through my last one (minus rent, thank goodness), would appreciate that too.
I whole heartily agree with everything expressed and addressed here. The only unpaid internship i took was in highschool when i was 15, before i was old enough to work anyway. At that internship i worked and actually learned a lot about the theatre and i could later apply at my high school. Then instead of working at a McDonalds or Sonic etc i worked as a spotlight operator for much more money because i had taken that internship. I'm ok with internships that benefit both parties but i couldn't even think of working at an internship where I had to get coffee fr people all day. Its BS that you learn business by getting someones coffee....yea you may be in the room but you can learn the same skills from listening to a educational video or reading a book. There are many internships out there and if you are skilled enough can wok at any of them. the key is to think about how that internship can help you, what company gets to have you work for them. as artists we are skilled labor and everyone is very unique. The work we pt out for the most part means something to somebody and we want to give that to a company who cares about us and our future.
Internships are a very important thing to most college students because they feel like they need an internship in the summers to give them more experience in a certain field and more marketable as a possible employee. Internships can also be a very bad thing to do if you do not find a real one. You should never work for free unless you are getting really good experience and learning a lot. If you are just making copies and getting coffee, then it is not a good internship for you to have. I had an unpaid internship this summer, but I was getting amazing experience and I learned a lot and made great connections. If I were doing the same job at a different and lower company then it would not have been worth it to not get paid. College students need to be very careful on picking the right internship, but it is also difficult to get internships in the first place. This whole process is very difficult and stressful and sometimes it is not worth it.
As someone who has done a number of unpaid internships back in high school, I definitely don't think that anyone should work for free, no matter how trivial the work is. Regardless of how important the work you do is, you are still devoting and giving your own time to your employer. I can remember the hours I spent sitting at this particular company watching the employees work while I did nothing (nothing was assigned to me). I'm not saying that I deserve to get paid for sitting there and doing nothing, but the company shouldn't be offering unpaid internships if they don't have anything for interns to do in the first place. I felt like I was wasting my time, and there was nothing I could've done about it. Paying interns will force companies to give interns useful and educational things to do, since no company would want to pay an intern to do nothing.
Unpaid internships are always a little tricky. I think in some situations it can be okay to work for free: as long as you are aware that you are actually volunteering. And in some cases, maybe it's just better to volunteer if you really want to be involved in something. Molly had a great conversation with us last year right around the time that internships were rolling in, in which she mentioned that one of the most important things is that you are aware that the unpaid internship is actually costing you money. When looking for a job, even as a college student that can live on very little, it is incredibly important to consider whether or not it is worth it to you to be doing that work and actually paying for it: I knew that working outside of my hometown meant I would need housing, and I couldn't accept a job that either didn't offer housing or didn't pay enough to cover that cost. Internships can be fun, especially in theatre (where you are less likely to be getting coffee and shuffling papers) but they are much more fun if you are actually compensated for the work you do.
Internships have often been the thought of creating valuable experience for the student and when it is a poor experience, it has been written off as just part of paying their dues to get to the top someday. I knew that unpaid internships are often more cost than they are worth because someone is still having to support you, but unfortunately I had no idea that unpaid internships have the same benefit as having no internship at all. This basically means that unpaid internships are often worthless. Internships are meant to be training and practical experience that a student can’t always find in the classroom. I think if there was a push to abolish the term internship and start offering more apprenticeships they would be more of an effective switch because the word apprentice has a historical context of respect and basic needs of food and housing being met. I believe the simple switch will help to stop the abuse and get back to the importance of offering people really chances to learn with the opportunity of not having to worry because their needs are being taken care of.
The fact that I had no idea that these types of internships were illegal is pretty concerning when I think about it. I am still deciding on what I want to do with my summer time, because while I do have the resources to work at an internship in NYC, the prospect of possibly working somewhere else and earning money to help pay for college expenses sounds much more secure than the gamble of an unpaid internship. There is a tendency to assume that even if all you see an intern doing is getting coffee or running errands for their employer, they must be learning something or getting some kind of valuable work experience...right? This video, however, shows that that may not necessarily be the case, and that in fact it often is not the case. It's pretty discouraging to learn that unpaid internships can actually have no effect at all on your employability, especially when there is a lot of discussion already in November about what people are planning on doing for the summer. I would love to get some practical theater experience in my summer months, but I want to make sure that I know exactly what I'm getting into when I apply.
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